To Tip or Not To Tip?!
Although I am an avid couponer and am always looking for ways to cut back on spending, I am NOT cheap when it comes to tipping. As a former waitress, I know how important tips are in the lives of those who work in service-based industries. Although I almost always tip at least 20% when dining out, I am sometimes a little more perplexed as to what to tip in the following situations: Purchasing food to-go, Hair Cut for yourself and/or your kiddos, Assistance with baggage when staying at a hotel, Purchasing espresso from Drive-Thru Coffee Shop, etc.
Check out the email that reader, Monica, recently wrote…
I was wondering if you could maybe post a question for comment if it is proper etiquette to tip when you pick up carry-out at a restaurant? This is a question I often wondered and although I enjoy saving money, don’t want to be cheap if you are supposed to tip when picking up to go orders. I have never worked in the food industry and thought this might be a good question to pose to your readers as I am sure others could learn from this as well. Thanks!
So, I am asking all of you to think about the following questions: What services do you believe require a tip, how much do you tip, do you tip even if the service is horrible etc? Share your thoughts and comments below. Thanks!
Ok as a server this is my opion. First if a server has to take the money under her/his sales for the day then yes you should tip. We remeber this and will help you right away in the future. If a bartender or hostes gets your food/money then it’s not required to tip. I am a coupon shopper, but I alway tip what the orginal price is of the food when I figure the tip. We work for our tips and you look very………..cheap when you don’t tip enough. Another point is always tip an adult meal price for a child, they are messier and require more of our attention at the end. I love kids so I get all the kids in my section. If the service is bad I’d like to be told why you didn’t tip me, I usually know if it was me or the person. I’ll admit I don’t always give the best service, usually because I’m overwelmed, please be understanding then.
Now haircuts, it varys, was it a good cut worth the price, then yes go all out. Getting bags I’ve heard 1 dollar/bag. I usually don’t stay places where this is required, I carry my bags myself.
If I ever wait on you I hope that I give you the best service possiable.
Stephanie
Oh and try to TIP IN CASH instead of adding it onto your debit card bill! Esp at restaurants I know that waiters have to declare a certain percentage of their tips, so friends who have waited tables have all told me they appreciate the tips in cash because they can just pocket them and keep all of it.
That’s called tax fraud, and the rest of us have to make up the difference. All waitstaff should claim ALL of their tips on their tax forms.
ah please like the people in the projects are not supported by your tax dollars. I usually tip with cash that way the server gets it and they do not have to declare it. Also When I waited tables it was customary to give your buss boy and bartender a certian percentage based on what you made. so if they get cash they keep most of it.
Well, I’ve seen the light. When you put it that way tax fraud is acceptable. I’ve got to figure out a way to do it with my job. 🙁
alot of their tips are divided out to bar tenders, busboys, runners, expo, etc. and etc…. the list can be long – usually once we do all of our tipping we end up going home with the required amount we have to claim for taxes… Many times the tiny wage that we make does NOT cover the amount of tax we owe and we end up having to pay out of pocket… so there is no fraud… to answer the other questions – we have to claim a certain percentage of our sales…. comped or used coupons are NOT deducted from this – so we have to tip all the above plus pay taxes on it as well – so if you tip on the end amount we end up getting way less than what the tipper intended. It is best to till on the ORIGINAL total bill, tip in cash (other than tax fraud you claimed some places don’t give the card tips until later – sometimes much later), be kind to all service personel and remember that if your food takes to long… typically it’s NOT the server’s fault – the kitchen is to blame alot of the time….
As for to-go orders… yes, you should tip on the order… personally, i don’t tip the full 20%… typically to-go workers are paid a much higher wage. Then everytime I go back I tip a little more each time – this way they see that I appreciate their good service and they continue to make sure my orders are correct. To-go is a tricky thing… if you tip alot and get home and find you are missing a bunch of things.. then your unhappy – if you tip small and you get home and they have thrown in extra dressing, etc then you feel bad …. try to get the same people if you frequent a particular place – they will remember you and you’ll know what to tip…
You should let them know that when they retire the amount of their social security check is calculated from their earnings. Additionally, anyone needing to prove income for approval on a car loan or apartment application would be doing themselves a disservice as well…they’re not saving that much by not paying taxes to make up for the consequences of not claiming those tips. As a server I did claim 100% of my tips after realizing this.
lol. by the time I retire I don’t think there will be much social security to worry about, if any.
Kristy’s point is accurate, but Anonymous is too, unfortunately.
They’ve been saying that for a lonnnnnnggggg time and soc sec is still around.
They’ve been saying that for long because they could see it heading for bankruptcy. Now, babyboomers are just starting to retire and take advantage and make those predictions come true. It will run out of money.
If your friends are not getting all of their tips from credit or debit cards their employer is breaking the law. Those servers should be getting all of that money, whoever takes the payment, should be taking the tip left for the server out of the cash drawer and giving it all to them!
I agree, definitely tip in cash if possible. My sister is a waitress and at some places if you tip on a credit/debit card the wait staff won’t see any of that money until they get their paycheck. Her company won’t give the wait staff their tips at the end of the night if it’s been paid on a card.
I have a friend that is a server/bartender and she said to always tip for ‘to go orders’. In her restaurant, the bartender was the one to put the order in, box it & bag it. She was also responsible for getting drinks for the entire restaurant AND she had 3 tables that she was waiting on as well as the people who want to sit at the bar. SO, she has to stop the bar service for the restaurant, stop serving her 3 tables & the people who eat at the bar, just to get the ‘to go orders’ prepared. So the bartender at this particular restaurant had a lot of responsibility. Just food for thought…….if there is someone who has to prepare your food & serve it to you, whether in the restaurant or for ‘to go’, ALWAYS tip!!! It is their livelyhood & many servers count on tips to pay their bills.
As far as take out orders go, it is true someone has to prepare your food. However, someone has to prepare your food if your dining in, so I don’t see the difference. I don’t tip the cook or other food preppers, I tip the waiter based on the service I receive. Putting my food in a box as compared to on a plate, doesn’t warrant a reward (which is what a tip is) for good service. Yes, someone had to take the time to put it in a box, but they didn’t have to smile and tolerate a face-to-face interaction, they didn’t have to refill my glass multiple times, and they didn’t have to worry about cleaning up after me.
I just wanted to say that if your kid pukes all over the floor you’re really a shit head if you then only tip %15. There is no excuse for undertipping when I have to clean up body fluids.
While I can certainly understand the sentiment here (and I do tip very well, especially when my kids are with me), I don’t think it’s necessary to use that kind of language here.
Agreed, no excuse for that kind of language. Also, 15% is plenty sufficient. Accidents happen….it’s part of the territory.
WHAT? You’re telling me if your server had to clean up your child’s bodily fluid, you would not consider an extra tip necessary? Are you kidding me? Cleaning up vomit is not in my job description, and I would hope if I went above and beyond to do so that you would at least tip me well, not the bare minimum of what is “adequate”.
If my child threw up, I would clean up what I could on my own.
If any sort of cleaning is required of waitstaff, then cleaning up puke is in their job description. The whole point of the business is eating, and sometimes when people eat they get sick. The same thing could happen to an adult. Furthermore, I didn’t say people shouldn’t give more if they feel badly about creating an extra mess. My point is there shouldn’t be expectations of an increased tip because of an accident.
I don’t begrudge anyone for an accident or for getting sick (that kind of thing can’t be controlled), I just think it’s pretty ignorant to sit here and argue that a baseline tip is adequate after someone goes above and beyond their duty (no, cleaning up vomit is not in my server description, nor is any kind of cleaning of that sort, but I would do it because it would bother my other tables and I want to keep them happy).
Why am I ignorant? Why is 15% baseline, and why is is not adequate? Please explain. Let’s actually make valid, rational comments before name calling. Again, I never said people shouldn’t tip more. As you will see with all of my posts on here, my beef is with “expectation” and an ever increasing one at that.
Why is 15% baseline? Because etiquette demands 15-20%, which would make 15% baseline. When a server is hired as a server, their employer pays them based off the expectation that they will sell a certain amount of food at a certain price (IE Applebees may expect a server to sell $300 of food a night) and to make 15-20% off that food, and then receive a salary of $2-3 on top of that. That is a server’s expected salary. When a server has to make life decisions (i.e. find an appropriate apartment to rent, make a grocery budget, choose an insurance plan), he/she bases decisions off this expected salary. That’s how the industry works, and that’s how this job works. When people choose to ignore the etiquette and expected server wage, of course a server will be upset, the same way an employee would be upset if he/she was shorted on his/her paycheck.
Just to clarify, I did not call you ignorant. But when you make the argument you made (without, I’m assuming, ever having been in a servers shoes), it’s sounds something like this to me “You’re a lowly server, quit complaining about your job, if you have to mop up my child’s vomit that’s your place to do so and I certainly won’t be appreciative or apologetic, and don’t expect me to PAY you for it- you’re already being paid what you DESERVE [that being $2/hr]”. Now, I would guess that’s not how you intended your message, but that’s certainly what it sounds like to someone who’s had to clean up vomit for a self important mother who thought she was better than you, and it’s very frustrating.
Honestly, if you want to tip 3%, go ahead and do so, but don’t try to justify it, please. Standard for the industry is standard for the industry, and it’s certainly not fair to punish today’s servers because tips have increased over the years. BTW, if you have a rude or snotty server, I definitely don’t expect you to over tip, but I think going into a restaurant with the attitude that a lowly server should take what they can get is just wrong.
Your assumptions about me couldn’t be further from reality. You’re letting your personal experience get in the way of seeing my points, so your reading them emotionally rather than rationally. Once again, I never said a server didn’t necessarily deserve more in instances where more is required. That is the point of tipping. My issue is with the expectation or demanded tip. It keeps going up, even though the price of food does as well. Should my child or myself create a larger than normal mess, it does not make me a tightwad if I still give the certainly fine 15% to 20%. It also doesn’t make me unappreciative or mean that I believe myself to be superior. I am horrified when my kid makes a huge mess on the floor, so I’ll usually try to pick most of it up at the end of the meal. I also can’t stand for him to ruin other people’s experiences, so I or my husband have taken him out and eaten in shifts if he can’t behave. If he threw up, I would be on my hands and knees cleaning and scrubbing. I have read a few posts on here requesting everyone to consider what’s really going on when a waitress takes a little too long or seems distracted. In other words, we should put ourselves in their shoes. Well, I think in this little vomit scenario the same should be asked of the server towards the patron. Maybe our fake family is on a tight budget that allows limited eating out, and maybe this was their one trip out to a decent restaurant that their budget allows each month. So, little Johnny unexpectedly gets sick and throws up. Fake mom and dad are embarrassed and come time to pay they want to give their waitress an extra nice reward for dealing with them. However, they didn’t budget for extra tip because Johnny got sick, plus they now have to go to the drug store and pick up some Pepto and Pedialyte or maybe even go to the doctor. So, while they would love to give more, they just can’t on this particular night. OR what is more likely to be the case, our fake family feels horrible. Fake mom takes Johnny to the car while Dad gets to-go boxes or just leaves the meal and pays. Dad is used to giving 15% to 20% and is so flustered by the situation and trying to get Johnny home, he just doesn’t think about the extra and automatically calculates his normal amount, fills it in, and leaves. Either way, our fake family meant no ill will, yet they will get talked about badly once they leave. Maybe they should stay home for every meal and they won’t have to worry about offending someone with in “insufficient” tip. I understand that you apparently dealt with a snotty mom once, but you are letting that experience become the filter through which you assess other tipping situations. Just to clarify the portrait you have painted of my in your head….I am actually very sympathetic to servers (unless the service is absolutely horrible). I am the one who is usually making excuses to others in the group for wrong orders, long waits, and sometimes even bad attitudes. I am often the one who reminds those I’m with that its not the servers fault the food is undercooked, overcooked, etc. You assume because I question why the baseline keeps creeping up even though food prices also increase, that I’m advocating for some ridiculously low standard. I don’t know where you pull 3% from, but I never stated anywhere that some sort of standard isn’t justifiable. I am a proponent of etiquette; this country needs to get more of it. However, the standard keeps going up. Who gets to decide that? When was 10% deemed too little and 15% old school, as someone on here put it? BTW, you will see on another post that you are wrong about my waitressing experience.
If a traditional sit-down restaurant offers curbside for To-Go, I tip a little, but not 15%. They are taking the extra effort to watch for me and run out the food. I tip more if the weather is bad.
I tip for food delivery because they are doing me a service I had decided at the time that I was too lazy to do for myself. The tip goes up the worse the weather gets.
At buffets that have servers to bring drinks and clear tables, I leave a small tip for them.
I tip for beauty services as the service warrants. If I am just getting a trim, I am not tipping as much as if I were to get highlights, for example. I also look for salons that recognize the difference between a trim (style maintenance) and a haircut (style creation) in their pricing structures.
I often dine alone. My money spends as well as anyone else’s, and I never ask to take a seating area that would seat more than two people. I DO NOT WANT TO SIT AT THE BAR, but that’s an issue with how they train their host/esses, not the waitstaff, so I don’t penalize the waitstaff. I have short legs and detest the bar atmosphere. However, I rarely receive more than ‘adequate’ service. I believe single diners are seen as either poor tippers or people who aren’t going to spend enough to make the tip worthwhile. Waitstaff, this is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If I feel neglected, you are not getting a good tip. I don’t need you to hover, but I need you to refill my drink and react when I am trying to get your attention. I may even want to order dessert, which will increase your tip, but do you know how may times I have changed my mind because I haven’t seen you for the past 10 minutes after I finished my entree? If I have to flag down another member of staff to go find you to bring me my check, etc, your tip is going to suffer.
As a single dinner, I spend much less time at my meal. You could probably seat and serve two singles in the same hour it might take for a pair and make the same tips. Singles don’t leave a mess and generally just want to enjoy their food and not have to mess with cooking. We’ll tip well if we are served well and not treated as an afterthought.
Just think about it. The to-go person is paid the same lame hourly wage all servers are and usually it’s a server who packs up your order (with all of your special requests) and that person makes a lame hourly wage. The tip is to make up for the restaurant paying a lame hourly wage. Why do restaurants pay a lame hourly wage? Because they are expecting you to tip on dine-in AND to-go orders. Did you know that in some states the hourly wage is only $2 dollars?! And here is the other thing. Whatever you order is factored into the daily sales tally of that server if you dine in or dine out. And believe it or not, the irs goes by what you sell and assumes that you receive at least 8% in tips on all sales. So please tip whenever you order food from a restaurant. It’s the right thing to do.
I forgot to mention…
In every restaurant/tipping establishment the server has to not only pay taxes on their tip (so they are basically tipping out a large percentage to the irs) BUT the server is required to tip out to the bar and also to busboys if there are any. For example. If you make $100 in tips you have to give 20% of that to the bar and then another cut to the busboys. The amount varies pr store, and sometimes even if you make zero you are still required to tip out a percentage of your sales to the bar. So if someone orders $500 in to go food and is not given a tip, the server is still required to give a percentage of that tip to the bar EVEN if the bar doesn’t even make a single drink for that sale. Much of this cash handling/transactions of tips is actually a requirement given to the store manager at the end of the night to make sure that you are indeed giving the correct amount/cut to the bar/busboys and the manager turns around and gives it to the bar/bus boys. And even if you do not sell a single alcoholic beverage in your entire shift you are still required to tip out a percentage of your sales/tips to the bar and even to the busboys even if they are busy cleaning other peoples’ tables!!! So now do you see why you should always leave a tip. Only people who have actually slaved in the service industry understand.
And one additional point. I know a lot of people claim to be excellent tippers when in fact they are being complete tightwads. 20% is what everyone should always tip and the reason is that after uncle sam and the bar and the bus boys get their cuts the server is really taking home much less! And please don’t freeride and assume that if you are dining in a large group that someone else will be tipping so you can skip out and let it slide. Because everyone gets cheap and it’s the server who loses out.
Though agree with pretty much everything you’ve said here, the tipping out to the bar really depends on the establishment. I have worked places where tipping out to the bar doesn’t happen at all, and also where the tipout is only a percentage of the alcohol sold, not the entire meal. As a bartender, I would *love* to work wherever you are talking about that tipout is 20% of the meal no matter what!
1. Customers are not responsible for the practices of the establishment that require sending a cut bartenders and/or busboys.
2. I have noticed that what is being deemed an appropriate tip has dramatically increased over a small amount of time. When I was younger, I remember constantly hearing that 10% was an appropriate tip for good service. Then as a teenager and young adult it was 15%. Now, you and many others, are claiming 20% is the bare minimum someone should tip. When will it be enough? I know someone will try to claim tips should rise as the cost of living increases. This happens automatically as the price of food increases. For example, a meal that cost $5 some time ago might now cost $10. At 10% the tip would have been $0.50 but is now $1.00. These things work themselves out, we don’t have to keep raising the acceptable rate of tipping.
3. Everyone (should) pay taxes. We all take home significantly less than we make. This is that should be addressed with the government, not by demanding more from patrons.
I agree; however people making the argument that a 10% tip on $5 then is ‘worked out’ by that same 10% tip on the same thing now costing $10 should realize that the cost of food has not increased to reflect the money that the restaurant is not paying their servers (which they should). When that now $10 item was $5, the min server wage was 2.13, the same as it is now. If the employers had to pay a higher min wage because of inflation and rising cost of living, they would just pass that cost to their customers via the menu. Consequently, the $5 item then that is now $10 does not congruently reflect the situation. If employers had to pay a higher minimum wage – lets say an increase to 3.19 – 50% – then conversely, that $10 item would actually be $15 because at $10 it does not reflect the 50% increase in server min wage. See? Your 10% tip would now be the same amount (1.50) as a 15% tip on $10. So, if the min wage had increased the same amount as prices have, then the percent tip would not increase – but you would still be paying the same.
Wow how out of base are you. Have you ever looked at the hr wage of a server? It is 2.13-2.50 an hr and that has not changed for 10yrs. So for you to say that a 50cent tip is enough for a 5.00 meal. Honey I hope that you dont go to the same resturant alot because those servers know who you are. Plus have you seen the movie waiting? You are probably getting low service and who knows whatelse in your food.
My husband works for the resturant industry and hears alot of stories about customers like you and it is not pretty what the servers do. especially when that person keeps coming back.
All I can say is YOU SUCK LADY. and if you have a job I hope that your boss says to you one day, sorry we gave you a raise last year isnt that enough? Stupid
Wow, Jenna P, how classy of you. Not only do I suck, I’m stupid. Well, I could question your ability to comprehend things you read since you completely misunderstood the whole point of the post. I didn’t say 50 cents was an appropriate tip on a $5 meal. I really like the “customers like me part” since you don’t know me. BTW, I was using simple, round numbers to demonstrate a more complex situation.
Kristy, I see what you’re getting at, but the onus should be on the employer to make up the difference, not the patron who leaves a discretionary tip.
While I understand where you are coming from, it is not actually the customer’s responsibility to make up for the server’s $2 wage. A tip is a gratuity for a service provided, so I am not going to leave the same tip for a to-go order that took about 5 minutes to prepare as for a meal where I spent an hour needing drinks and other service provided. As a former waitress, I know that one of the reasons you have to declare your tips is so that the IRS makes sure your employer is paying you at least minimum wage. (Granted, that’s a lot of work for minimum wage, but so are a lot of other jobs.) So, if you happen to work in an environment where you don’t make much in tips, your employer has to make up the difference – not the customer. As a customer, I am not going to tip you well if you gave horrible service, just to make up for your low wage. Do your job well, and I will reward you well.
As a coupon diva…. I always tip before coupon 🙂
My family of 4 ate at a well known restaurant. I had 4 fabulous coupons that made for a free meal for 4 !!! The waitress was very suprised when I tipped the before coupon amount. She assumed that I wasn’t going to tip ! Needless to say… she was very suprised.
😉
I currently do medication deliveries from the local pharmacy to our customers. Should I be expecting a tip? Most of the time I am also given a list of instore items that the customer would like in addition to their medicine. I have done a lot of deliveries and the only tip I got was for 50 cents. I was rather insulted by this. (I don’t think the tip should be based on the amount of money spent, but I think 1-2 dollars would be reasonable.) I know some of my customers can’t drive because of lack of a car or because they shouldn’t be driving. But I also know that most of the deliveries I do are because some people are simply lazy and don’t want to come into the stores themselves. How does everyone else feel on this particular service and if this is something that you should tip for. It takes me a lot of time and effort to not only process there medication order, but then I have to get all the other items the customer as requested. I’ve even had to go and do deliveries at night while in the middle of a storm. Thanks for the imput I’m curious to see what everyone else says.
I’ve never heard of this service, but I would certainly think a tip would be in order. I wouldn’t begin to know what a standard would be, but if I had to guess, I would probably tip similar to pizza delivery.
I think it depends. Is this your sole function at your job? I mean, were you hired to get these orders together and make deliveries? If so, I say a tip would be nice but don’t expect it. Also, I assume a lot of your customers are elderly people on a fixed income. I would keep that in mind; they may not have the means to tip. As far as the lazy folks go, good luck with that. Lastly, don’t be insulted by the $0.50 tip. Consider where it came from. When I worked at a fast food establishment as a teenager, an elderly gentleman knocked his drink over. He felt horrible about it and insisted on helping me clean it up. He then forced me to take a tip; it was a quarter. He genuinely thought a lot of that quarter and was sincerely rewarding me for my effort. He meant well and was giving what he knew to be a sufficient tip, probably based on his experiences when he was much younger. In this case, though, no tip was necessary.
As a server I expect a 20+% tip for good service on the bill BEFORE all coupons, discounts and promotions (Bogo). I personally tip 25-30% when I go out to eat, more for exceptional service and less for poor service. I DO tip on poor service, however I leave a little note letting them know how I feel about my experience. Servers are required to tip a percentage of their tips out to others on staff (bartenders, food runners, busers, some even host/hostesses) this s generally 5-8% of their sales which is actually 25-40% of what they make assuming they average 20% tips. The IRS requires servers to claim 8% of their sales for taxes, however most restuarants require a higher percentage 10-12% of sales. Servers are required to tip out and claim this money whether or not the make any of it. So when servers get poor tips or even no tips they are actually losing money by waiting on that table.
I tip 20% at salons/barber shops. I don’t have they inside scoop on exactly how that industry works. But I do have friends who work in that industry who I have asked what they expect and I was told 15-20%
I usually carry my own bags/luggage. But I am under the impression you should give them a dollar or two for Each bag. I don’t know anyone to confirm this though.
I forgot to mention to go food…yes you should tip them. Servers have to place the order box the food and bag the order. And once again tip out and claim tips on those sales.
This is the second post I read that gave the impression that the IRS expects 8% or so of your sales as tip, even if you didn’t get a tip. I would like some more information on this because in my life experiences, you don’t pay taxes on money you don’t receive.
The IRS will audit a restaurant whose servers claim less than 8% of their total sales (over a certain amount of time). To avoid this, most restaurants require servers to claim 10-12% of their total sales at the end of the night. Generally, if you make slightly less than that, it will be negated by the nights you make slightly more than that, so there is no issue. The point here is that, if every patron tipped 10-15%, and you were required to tip out a certain percent of that, servers would be forced to claim more than they actually made. As I said, it’s generally not a problem and will even out in the long run even if there is a shortage of tips on one particular night to make the 10-12%.
Restaurants will also be more likely to be audited if the servers (on average) claim a significantly higher percentage of profit on credit card tips than cash tips. For example, if servers claim an average of 18% gratuity on CC tips but only 10% on cash tips, this is a red flag for the IRS. Most servers don’t realize this, but it’s definitely something to keep in mind!
ETA: You would have to understand how claiming tips at a restaurant works to fully grasp the concept here (and it sounds like from your PPs that you’ve never worked in one, which I think is unfortunate because I think everyone should have that life experience), but basically you have to record your tips at the end of each night so that they can be reported by your employer to the IRS. CC tips are generally automatically recorded as you have to enter them into the computer to receive cash in return. Servers are usually responsible for either writing down their cash tips on a form for their employer or entering them into a computer system which will track them throughout the year. HTH.
Well, Leah, you would be wrong. I have worked in a restaurant. I was hired to work in food prep but often had to pull waitstaff duties since there were never enough waitresses. Since I was only “helping” the other waitresses they got the tips (hence my limited knowledge on how that system works) even though they may have never dealt with a customer or table at all. Addtionally, it is not the patrons fault that the particular restaurant requires servers to claim a certain percentage that they may not have actually received. That is an issue to address with the restaurant. And while I may not be an expert on reporting tips to the IRS, I am pretty sure that it is never wise to pay taxes on money you didn’t make. Lastly, while I do have the apparently all-important experience waiting tables, I feel that my life would be equally fulfilled and great without that experience. Being a waitress isn’t the only job a person can hold that gives them life skills.
I’ve had a career and I have degrees, so I understand that life skills can be learned elsewhere. I choose to wait tables because it allows me to maximize my time with my son. My explanation showed that servers actually do not, over time, claim more to the IRS than they make on any given paycheck. FTR, I generally make an average of over 20% of my sales/night, and I live quite well on tips. I don’t really have any issues as far as that goes. I am just surprised that someone is so fundamentally opposed to a 20% gratuity. The difference between a 15-20% gratuity is, what, a few dollars? It seems absurd to oppose that. Why? I’m sure you’d be upset if someone complained that your salary was inflated and you were undeserving of it- I am offended by the insinuation that mine is, as well.
Again you see my comment as some sort of personal attack. I, again, never said 20% or more tip isn’t warranted. I have given much more on many occassions. It’s the expectation and demand that it be higher, and that keeps increasing. I never said you, or anyone else, doesn’t deserve a 20% tip. The word deserve is key, though. Not everyone deserves everything, but many of the statements made in this forum have been blanket and given the clear impression that anyone who gives anything less than 20% (yes, even for poor service) is a cheapo. I sense some sort of the defense with your opening remarks about your career and degrees. I don’t know what that’s about or what that point is, so I’ll try to nip that in the bud. I think it’s great you base your career decisions around spending time with your child. That’s admirable. My comment about getting life skills from other types of jobs was based on you letting me know how unfortunate it was that I had never had the experiences that come from being a waitress (although, I have).
You can see my previous comment as to why 15-20% are accepted and why it is not unreasonable as to why they are expected.
On the contrary, I don’t see any of your comments as a personal attack on me, nor do I have the inability to see them objectively, because I make well over what you call a reasonable tip on a regular basis, and I know I am deserving of them as I work very hard and I work at a restaurant where a higher level of knowledge and skill is required than most restaurants. I also work with a class of people who can generally afford to eat out regularly and tip graciously.
I am curious to know when the ‘average’ tip percentage changed from 15% to 20%. I tip 15% for adequate service. Adequate is taking the order, delivering the food, and refilling the drinks with the bare minimum competency and a pleasant expression. Excellent service gets more, lousy service gets less.
When anyone says s/he -expects- a certain percentage for a tip, I start to see red. No one is entitled to a tip merely because one holds the job. One has to -perform- the job to earn the tip. Bad performance, bad tip. If you are always getting bad tips, it’s not because everyone is a tightwad. It is a signal that you need to improve or seek employment in another establishment where you won’t have to rely on tips.
I have to perform on my job if I want a raise. I can’t just be there and hold down the floor and expect something out of it. The difference is that waitstaff gets an evaluation with every table and I get one once a year. The expectation that one performs one’s job to a particular level of satisfaction is the same.
agreed!!
Yes, I can see that POV, HOWEVER, if you have a bad day on the job and make a mistake, you do NOT take a salary cut for that day. If you slip up a few times or forget something, you still make salary. I think you have to evaluate the situation, and I think people are very bad at doing this. For instance, if you go out to eat on a Saturday night in a packed dining room and your server is polite but overwhelmed and makes a mistake or two, this is entirely different than a server being rude or neglectful. The unfortunate truth is that most people can’t discern between the two situations. I find it interesting that people in salaried positions want to make the argument “you shouldn’t expect to be paid a certain wage for a service” when you are paid a certain wage for daily jobs regardless of how you perform (yes, there are raises, etc., but servers are also given better shifts and section based on performance which is parallel). If you genuinely have a problem with the service, you should be speaking with a manager, otherwise, you should tip adequately.
That was the entire point of justthisgirl’s post. Tipping should be adequate, not expected, yet the definition of adequate keeps increasing. She wanted to know when it increased from 15% to 20%. In an earlier post, I recounted how 10% used to be sufficient for good service when I was a child (and I’m 27).
I don’t know where you live (maybe this is a locality issue) but if you are 27 then I was waiting tables when you “were a child” and 10% was definitely NOT considered an adequate tip at that time. It was still 15%. This was almost 20 years ago and tips under 15% were considered, by waitstaff, to be pretty crappy.
The to-go food tip question is a good one. I’ve been confused by that one myself. When I worked in a restaurant the hostess took care of to-go orders. In my later restaurant days I would often work as a hostess/wait staff manager if the boss was out of town and I didn’t expect any tips for to-go orders. I made more money an hour and considered it to be part of my job. Because of that I don’t often tip for to-go food, but after reading comments here I will be amending that practice a bit. I think 15% for putting the food in a bag and bringing it to the counter is excessive but I’ll be sure I give a little something!
Maybe it is a locality thing because I clearly remember 10% being the acceptable tip amount (and not just because that’s what my parents did).
For the record, I am not salary, I am hourly.
If I have a bad day AND MY CUSTOMERS KNOW ABOUT IT, I get a talking-to by my supervisor. My baggage is not supposed to affect the service I deliver to my customers. It will affect me monetarily in the end if this happens too often. I don’t buy any bad day excuses. Your customers should not have any clue you are having a bad day. If the kitchen is being slow or is overwhelmed, let your tables know its taking a little longer and apologize. That way they know its not YOU slacking off.
I have worked plenty of bad jobs. I’ve even had a job that involved tipping. When I was desperate needed a somewhat stable and reliable income, I worked fast food before even dreaming of applying for a job with tip-based income. Fast food is required to pay minimum wage at the least. I’ve worked two minimum wage jobs at the same time rather than go for a tipped position because I knew what was involved in a tipped position and I wanted nothing to do with that.
I am not arguing that you shouldn’t be expected to be paid a certain wage. You should expect to be paid the wage that your place of employment and you agreed to, when you agreed to work for them, whether that is $2 per hour or $20 per hour. The tip is an arrangement between you and the customer, not between you and the employer. I do NOT agree with the fact that it is legally OK to pay you $2 an hour. If I had the chance to change that law, I would. I’d rather pay more for the food and know the servers were getting at least minimum.
You know what, I do not think I should tip someone for doing their job.( now, hold your horses, ladies) like hairstaylist and pedicure people. I have yet to find someone who makes $110 per hour???? Well that is how much my hairdresser got for just doing her job!???And with this number I took in account the hairdresser who left a comment on here, that they “only” make 50% of what you were charged. My bill was $180 and then I “had to tip” $35??? If you go by that system, then you should have to tip everybody, casheirs, dentists, receptionists, shoe repairers, electrician, plummer etc.
Now, with waitresses, that’s a different story. They get at least 20%, because I know they are not paid other then tips.
Just returned from vacation in Miami. Every restaurant we went to automatically put 18% on the bill as a gratuity. Also went to the spa, got a manicure, pedicure and massage – same 18% gratuity placed on the bill. I used to be a waitress, I have always tipped well, as a rule I tip 20% of the before coupon price. I do not agree with automatically putting the gratuity on every bill especially the $200 spa bill. The people who work there do not get the kind of wages that waitresses get. It also leads in some instances to the server not getting what he would have got, we did tip over the 18% in one restaurant we went to. It also makes me tip someone when I did not get good service!
Amen. Certainly those professions who are legally paid less (waiters, etc.) because of the expectation of tip are fine to tip, but I am so tired of tip envelopes and jars everywhere I go. The sole function of the nail salon (and similar establishments) is to give me a manicure or pedicure for the price I pay. The one that really burns me up is tip jars at fast food places and ice cream shops. I asked for a vanilla cone, you were hired (at least making typical minimum wage) to put ice cream in the cone, you put ice cream in the cone, and I paid for it. What about that is exceptional and requires a tip?
I do tip my hairdresser but just $10. Most of them are independent contractors (at least mine is) and get most of the money (I also tip the girl who washes my hair). Why am I going to tip when the person is getting the $$, unlike a delivery person, or waitress who doesn’t. As for to-go, we do tip, but not a full 20%, like it was mentioned, a waitress/waiter has to service my needs while I’m there AND clean up once I’m gone so they deserve more than the person who just walked my food out or handed it to me over the counter. If its a local place, I usually don’t tip, because they are the owners – and they’ll get 100% of what I’ve paid. I’ve been told that for baggage its $3-$5 per bag! I’ll carry it myself!
My husband has worked at a few salons and many places you make less than 50%. The owners take 50% plus they deduct product costs for each service. He never expected a certain percentage but he certainly hoped for a tip if people are happy with the service he provided him.
I do 20-25% tip for waiters at a sit down rest. & less for to go orders. I have in a very few instances left less for really poor service but b/c we have lived on tip money I can’t not leave a tip when I know how little they make.
I’ve worked in the restaurant industry for over fifteen years. I always tip 17% because 15% is old school. Unless the service is horrid than I will tip 10%. Most restaurants make the server tip out to the bus help 1% and the bartender 3%. Your best bet is to observe to see if the waitstaff has to bus their own tables. Some Greek owned restaurants make them clear there own tables. For pizza delivery I tip $ 4.50 for a large pizza. I figure $ 1.50 per mile. I live in an unincorporated area. We only have one pizza company that delivers to us. If the weather is bad I tip $6.00 for a large pizza. Recently I had Free haircut coupons for Sportclips. These are found on the back of Dominick’s receipts. My husband and I went for the Free haircuts. I had a bang trim done and my husband had a regular haircut. Our total would have been $34.00 I tipped the hairstylist $8.00 for the two of us. Other clients weren’t tipping at all to the other hairstylists. Shame! Karma will get them.
I certainly agree that you should tip on your pre-discount amount. I do have a question. Why is 15% “old school” and when did it become so?
I think tipping as part of anyone’s wage should be eliminated entirely. It is ridiculous for people to work, and get paid whatever the customer feels like leaving them based on the wildly varying prices on the menu – why tip more for a fillet mignon dinner than for a chicken dinner? Until the system changes, however, I leave 15-20% for sit down food, and 10% for a buffet. I base the percent on before coupon prices, and usually add $1 since I only drink water. I usually do not tip for to-go food.
I work in a rest. and a lot of times waiting on someone who orders the buffet is even more work than a regular dinner. Some people go back to the buffet way too many times and leave a lot of wasted food on their plates and get their soda or water refilled 3 or 4 times. PLEASE take this into consideration if you’re only leaving 10% when ordering the buffet.
I agree with you. If everyone got a decent rate of pay, we wouldn’t be expected to supplement their wage and spend more money for a service we are already paying for. Heck, I wouldn’t even mind if restaurants, nail places, etc. raised their prices by a couple of bucks and we didn’t have to tip!
Just to clarify, I agree with Krista
I love to see these comments, as they provide me with an idea of others opinions. I, too have always wondered what the appropriate tip amount is in certain situations.
I definitely agree with Krista, that salaries should not be dependent on tips. Servers work very hard, and should not be penalized based on the views/opinions of each patron. However, I do find it somewhat disurbing that many of the people who work in the restaurant industry seem “entitled” to at least a 20% tip. From my understanding, servers are hired with a knowledge of their base pay, and they understand that tips are discretionary. They should not expect a minumum of 20% extra just for doing their job. With that being said, I have to assume that the people with these expectations are experienced servers, are excellent at their job, and are consistently receiving at least 20% based on their abililty and skills. In that case, they deserve great tips, but this rule should not be applied to every server, and patrons should not be considered “cheap” if they leave a lower percentage when treated poorly by the waitress/waiter (as I certainly have in the past).
Just for the record, I do tip around 30% for exceptional service. I only tip 15% if the service was terrible. I also tip more when I have my children with me, as I know that they usually require more attention (although I always pick up the floor and table after my children so that I do not burden the wait staff with our messes). I tip at least $2 for bags, and I think 20% is a fair number for hair stylists, pizza delivery drivers and spas. I don’t usually tip for take out orders, as I assume that the chefs, and staff in the kitchen (who do not work on tips) are bagging the items. Since the practices of each restaurant are different, I don’t feel that it’s my responsibility to know which ones require their tipped employees to perform these duties. I also don’t usually tip at the drive through for coffee, although I know that most people do. I consider Dunkin Donuts and Starbucks in the same category as fast food such as McDonalds, and I know that fast food workers do not get tips. I would be interested in hearing what others tip at coffee shops.
It used to be that the tip ensured good service and so it was based on the service you received. However, things have changed. As evidenced by many of these posts, tip is no longer something someone has to earn. Rather, it has somehow been distorted to become the duty of the patron to give a tip no matter what. And not just any tip…you must give whatever is deemed enough in order to escape being labeled as cheap or a tightwad. Based on the way things are going, 50% tip will be bare bones in the near future.
You make a good point in a way. Previously, tips were never intended to be a part of the base pay – that was the restaurant’s responsibility and tips were for a ‘job well done’.
Now, restaurants for some reason believe that their customers should be paying their employees instead of them. If restaurants want their customers to pay their employees for them, why not be more clear about it? Charging a ‘server fee’ would bring back tips to their original purpose – a tip – not an expectation or for the purpose of supplementing the failed obligation of the restaurant for base pay.
Customers would see more clearly that they are passing their obligation of a server’s base pay, hopefully would disagree that they need to pay part of what should be the restaurant’s payroll, object to such practices and therefore they would lose business and be forced to resume their obligation for the payroll of their staff.
Yes.
I consider orders placed over the phone or internet for “pick up” at the restaurant and “to go” orders that are added on after you have finished dining to be the same thing. I live in NYC and take out menus always advertise free delivery, but I still tip $3-5 depending on weather and weight of my order, but never based on the cost of the food. I did not know “to go” orders factored into a server’s daily sales. I think that practice is wrong. This portion of the bill I consider a separate “pick up” order. When I go to pick up food and I see they are busy I will tip $1-3 depending on the size of my order and if I am offered water if I am still waiting for my food. Tipping a percentage based on the total cost of food I am picking up makes no sense to me. I am not being waited on for an hour by a server as if I were dining in. The only service I received is someone packing my bags, I don’t even ask for utensils so the establishment saves money on that as well. I apply the same tipping practice to the “to go” portion of my dining bill. If my not tipping or under tipping on a “to go” order is negatively impacting your income, you should request this portion of the bill be separated from your daily sales as a “pick up” order and not a “to go” order. If I’m expected to tip the same on a “to go” order, I’ll go home and place an order for delivery to save myself a few dollars on top of not needing to carry bags home.
How about your hairdresser?! Does anyone ever tip the hairdresser!!
Yes I do. When I use my debit card, they even ask “Is this the amount you want to put on your card?” In other words, how much tip should I add here? They add it to your total, there is no space to fill it in after the receipt is printed.
I don’t think it should be socially obligated, like at restaurants. However, I tip for good service so they will remember me and my preferences and I will continue to get good service.
please do they don’t make nearly as much as you think. If you go to a salon they may make 50% many times less than that for the service provided. If it is a place like supercuts they make an hourly wage but it is pretty low.
i’m in the restaurant business so i have seen and heard it all. hopefully this will help you realize where we are coming from.
when dining out you should tip 20% or more before all and any discounts for good service. you should still tip at least 15% for bad service. servers/bartenders can make as little as $2/hr in some places!! and just because they may look busy at the time. and you feel like they may be making money at other tables, you have to divide that across their entire shift which includes hours of setting up the restaurant and closing it down where they are not making any tips during those times. also, unless a server was actually rude to you or did something drastically wrong, sometimes it was not their fault. maybe someone called in sick that day so they had to take double the tables. maybe the kitchen is behind which is why your food took so long. cold food does not equal bad service… the kitchen could have messed up the order… which proper server etiquette is to never place blame on anyone else so in that situation i always take full responsibility which people can either a. appreciate or b. hold against me.
on take out orders you don’t need to tip 20% but you should at least tip something since they usually make the same amount as the servers and still have to put your order in, box it up ect. They are still alotting time to take care of you opposed to other dine in guests. Even 10% is appreciated. also, i have a few take out customers that take forever to place their order over the phone. some nights i have a full bar and have to ignore them to take an order where you can hear them yelling all over the house to see what people want.
you should also tip on delivery. i do say check to see if they already charge a delivery fee AND if that fee goes to the delivery person directly. i know some companies keep the to put towards gas ect. again, you don’t have to tip 20% but at least 10% is sufficient. delievery is NOT an easy job, i think it is one of the most stressful in a restaurant. again, they are the ones taking your order, bagging it up ect.
to end the restaurant tipping novel, if you can afford to go out to eat you can afford to tip.
I have to ditto Cheryl’s comment above.
Some things people don’t consider when tipping a server:
A. You are supposed to tip (whatever percentage you are planning to tip) before coupons, discounts, food that is given for free by the manager, etc. When my guests are not happy (because of the kitchen taking too long, food being prepared incorrectly, whatever), I INSIST management give them a free meal, free dessert, take their drinks off the check, etc. This usually makes double the work for me (tracking down management, making sure the food is refired properly, preparing desserts), and usually makes the bill substantially smaller. It is really frustrating when I am then tipped 15% of the bill after all discounts. A poor server would have apologized to the guest and forgotten about it and gotten a 15% tip of a much larger bill. Think about it.
B. If you pay part of your bill with a gift card, you still need to tip on the whole bill! This has happened dozens of times- a patron has a $100 bill, uses and $50 GC, pays $50 on CC and the tip I receive is clearly based off the charge to the credit card, not the meal. Do people forget that their bill is $100 even if they only paid $50 OOP?
C. If there is poor service (genuinely poor service, not just a server being overwhelmed and making a mistake), speak with a manager. Give the server a chance to know where he/she is messing up so he/she can improve in the future.
D. It is so frustrating when a table says “The service was excellent! We’ll be back!’ and then tips 10%. I do like making people happy, but I’m a single mom trying to support my son, and I can’t survive on verbal tips! If you think the service was great- tip 20%.
OK, I realize that was a rant- here are my personal tipping rules (that I’m sure most of you will disagree with): I usually tip 20-25% after discounts, comps and coupons (I realize this isn’t standard, and I’m not saying others have to do this). If I have my son with me, I will tip an extra $1-2, because he is 1 and usually doesn’t get much/anything off the menu, but they still have to clean up after him, bring me extra napkins, etc. If a friend and I go out for an app and cocktails or if I split a meal with someone, I usually tip closer to 30%, because our bill was very low but we require the same amount of effort. If my server is great or if I recognize the server and he/she seems to be having a bad night, I’ll tip more because I think sometimes a server needs it. An extra $1-2 means little to me, but can really make a server’s night!
I think your guidelines are fine, but I have to ask about D. If the person leaves a tip of 10% and thinks that’s okay, why are they wrong? Tips are discretionary and it is that person’s view that 10% is what is warranted. I understand from all the other posts on here, why 10% isn’t what servers want to see, but the patron shouldn’t be faulted for not knowing about tipping out and the tax demands of a particular restaurant (over and above the apparent 8% of the IRS). I’m starting to agree with Krista…no more tipping and $3 wages….everybody is subject to the same minimum wages and market pay.
I never made an argument regarding the IRS, I simply explained the system.
Perhaps you live in a different part of the country, but here it is considered extremely rude to leave a 10% tip- most people would only leave a tip of that sort in exchange for extremely poor service. So it is insulting to be praised for excellence of service while at the same time being given a 10% tip.
The original question was in regards to etiquette (albeit the etiquette of tipping a carry out server, but still a question of etiquette, not personal opinion), and this would be considered improper etiquette, whether the person feels justified or not is a different question altogether.
I’m not arguing the rate to the IRS. I only said apparently because that is apparently what it is based on your and other people’s posts. I have no idea about any of that. I think where I live most servers would probably view 10% as insufficient as well. I understand what the original question deals with, but I question why etiquette on tipping has changed so much so recently.
I don’t know where you live, but etiquette in my area of the country has not changed in my mother’s lifetime (as far as she can remember, 15% and above was always the “acceptable” tip). We’ve had this conversation many times.
Odd. If I recall from some other posts, I’m not the only one on here who has commented on how the standard percentage has increased. I guess we could all live around each other.
I am a waitress. And nothing drives me more crazy is when people leave change on the table. I mean if you are going to throw some dimes and pennys on the table why bother. The place that I work is a family diner in a small town, we have the same people every day or the same people on certain days of the week. The general rule at MY particular place is that if you are a party of 1 then you get 1 dollar party of 2 you will get 2 bucks and so on. It is really sad !! Every once in awhile you will get a 5 on the table and that is from other servers-lol. When my family goes out this is what I base my tip on :
Family of 5
1) Is the server friendly as in does she smile?
2) Does she talk to my children like they are humans and not ol crap I have kids at my table.
3) Is my order correct?
4) how many times did I send her to get something for the table?
5) Did she keep our drinks refilled ?
I start with 10.00 bucks and I will deduct according to service.
1) no smile? minus 1 buck
2) totally ignore my kids and rolls eyes preparing of a mess ? minus 1 buck
3) order not right ? well….. it might not be her fault check out the situation first
4) if i send her to the kitchen to get various things then that is lots of running and she deserves it.
5) if I sit there and have a empty glass while I am eating my food yea i could grab a sip from hubby but I shouldn’t have to.
If all else fails she will get 5 bucks because after all she did take the order and bring out the food and will have to clean up the mess when we are gone.
i hope your ten dollars to start with is 15%…..
That’s episode of 3rd Rock From the Sun where the main guy (Dick?) learns about tipping. He starts with like a pile of 100 $1 bills on the table and removes one everytime he isn’t pleased. The waiter is thrilled at first, but by the end of the night all the money is back in Dick’s wallet.
I have a family friend that actually does this. It’s always been with a party of 10 or more though.
What about cashiers? We have to not only put all your stuff in bags and then put all your bags in your cart (at least I do) but sometimes we have to deal with people who come in with 50 or more coupons and half of the coupons will beep. Then I have to go through and check to make sure that you actually have that item. I had one customer that took 20 minutes to wait on because almost all 50 of her coupons had to be adjusted down because we are not to give anyone overage. I just think that sometimes “tipping” should not be expected. A waitress should just be paid more than minimum wage. We should not be expected to pay 20% more on top of the already high cost of eating out. If we tip a waitress for doing their job, then why not the mail carrier for delivering our mail, the cashier at the store, the bus driver for driving our kids to school everyday, the list could go on and on! I just don’t really think that it should be expected, you are paid to do a job why should we have to pay you too.
I am going to add, why not tip a nurse! They wait on you hand and foot and deal with some crazy and nasty stuff. I guess you could say because it is our job! I agree waitresses should be paid atleast minimum wage. But we shouldn’t be expected to pay the employees for the restaurant, we are already paying them for our food (the restaurant that is).
I totally tip for dinning in, as long I had decent service… level of service is equal to tip. For example, if I sit there for more than 5 minutes with an empty glass… that will effect the tip.
When I carry out, I don’t usually tip, I’m not sitting down, expecting to be served, have my drinks poured, asking to have ketchup or whatever. I walk in pick up a bag pay for the contents of said bag and walk out. I don’t tip the casher at grocery store… so why when I get cary out?
As far as tipping at a salon, depends on the service again. I don’t go to a high end salon, usually just a place around the corner where for a hair cut she charges $20 and a trim $12. When its a whole new hair style.. I tip $5, a trim $3. If I go to the nail salon.. which would be a total splurge.. I usually tip $1-2 for every $10 depending on the level of customer service.
I’m not saying that this is the way it should be.. but this is what I typically do!
The opening lines of this post caused a question to pop in my head. Based on previous posts, I have concluded generally two things. 1. Baseline tip is 15%-20% and 2. You should be hesitant to reduce your tip based on bad service because it’s rarely the server’s fault. So my question is: Why is it hardly ever ok to reduce the percentage you tip a server, but it is expected that you increase it for good service (which you should get anyway)?
I almost always tip 20% at a restaurant. If the wait staff is really bad – ie. not just the food took a longtime to come out (not their fault), but we were ignored, not greeted, sat there waiting for our bill or change for 20 minutes, then I’ll tip less (prob 10-15%), depending on the service (that is what a tip is for, by the way!). I can see when a server is overwhelmed ad the restaurant is busy, and I understand that everyone has bad days, so if the service is acceptable I give 20% (pre-coupons, discount, etc). I have only once not left a tip at all, and our service was absolutely atrocious – (we were in Montreal with a group of about 10, and had 3 waitresses for our table and no one else was in the restaurant) some people in our group never got drinks, orders came out at all different times – at one point, after waiting an hour, 2 people got up and cancelled their orders and went to burger king instead. It was that bad. They were well aware of why we weren’t happy.
I don’t tip for “to go” food, ie, when we order from a pizza shop and pick it up at the counter ourselves. Why would I? I’m paying for them to prepare the food, that’s part of the price. Also, I know that at least around here, if you’re working the counter at a sub shop or pizza place, you are making $8-10 dollars already – so getting food orders is part of your job. I tip delivery people 20%, 15% if the place is charging a delivery fee. I tip 20% at the hair/beauty salon and $1/bag for bag handlers, though like others I tend to do that myself.
Above all, if the service is EXCEPTIONAL, then they’ll get a higher tip. I also will go out of my way to write a quick email to a store/restaurant manager to let them know if someone went above and beyond. I’ve worked in restaurants and retail, and in my experience, it always wins the employee some brownie points with their boss at the very least!
I originally posted this question under another post, but I really want it answered so I made reposted it on its own (to decrease the chances of getting lost in the thread).
Based on previous posts, I have concluded generally two things. 1. Expected baseline tip is 15%-20% and 2. You should be hesitant to reduce your tip based on bad service because it’s rarely the server’s fault. So my question is: Why is it hardly ever ok to reduce the percentage you tip a server, but it is expected that you increase it for good service (which you should get anyway)?
Why should you expect good service, in other words service that is above what the server is required to do? The comments on here show opinions that people tip more for EXCEPTIONAL service, in other words service that is beyond ‘good’. I think it would be easier to define a scale in which the different connotations I personally have for verbiage such as ‘bad service’ and ‘good service’ in the effort to make sure I’m talking about the same thing that you are:
5. Exceptional
4. Good
3. Adequate
2. Poor/Bad
1. Terrible
In my opinion:
That’s my way of thinking of it in a ‘scale’ form. Adequate should be what the server is expected to do – nothing more, nothing less. Good service is nice but not a mandatory requirement/expectation of a 5 or 10% tip increase, and I will never leave a server that has provided me with exceptional service without a minimum 5 to 10% increase of a regular tip that I would give for adequate service.
Now, for the other direction I use the same methods. Poor/bad service is below the expectations of the server but doesn’t immediately warrant a decreased tip (I think this is where I would put the ‘might not be the server’s fault’ benefit of the doubt that you talk about). Terrible service is a level that would definitely decrease the tip from my regular tip that I would give for adequate service.
Again, this is my own opinion and I am not saying that others should follow these guidelines. I reference this to show the difference that it’s not that you should increase your tip for anything above adequate and not likewise decrease it for anything below adequate – which is what I think you were asking.
What about those people who come into a restaurant and have had a bad day themselves? Don’t you think they might tend to be overly critical and label service as bad instead of adequate just because they’re more irritable?
I totally get what you’re saying and don’t disagree. My reference to good service, I think corresponds to adequate on your scale. In other words, what’s expected/ what you’re hired to do.
I think someone who’s had a bad day is probably overly critical of everything, not just the service they receive at restaurants. I have certainly witnessed some episodes of waiter abuse from other tables, and I try to compensate by being extra nice.
You can increase/decrease based on service, as long as your increase/decrease falls within the proper etiquette of 15-20%. If you get good service, tip 20%, if you get poor service, tip 15% and talk to a manager. Anything over 20% would be considered bonus for exceptional service, the same way most salaried employees get bonus from time to time at any other job.
Just my opinion, but that’s because I see gratuity as part of a server salary rather than a bonus. Funny, because the government sees gratuity as a salary, as well. Do I think it’s right that the system is set up that way? No, but that’s the way it is. If companies start paying their employees living wage, then people are free to think of a tip as a “bonus” for excellence of service rather than a salary.
BTW, the less servers make, the less skilled you can expect them to be. If, as an industry, servers start to make less, you can bet that skilled workers are going to move on and find other jobs. Seeing as many people here already think the service is often sub par when they go out to eat, I would venture to guess this is not the future of the service industry that people want to see.
If I get poor service, I don’t think anyone should expect a minimum from me. If my experience is ruined by the fault of the server, they should expect to get what I decide to give them and be fine with it. If servers want more consistent pay, they need to take that up with their employers and existing laws that allow things to be the way they are. The patron should not have a socially demanded amount expected from them for substandard service.
I’m done arguing this point with someone who clearly has no compassion for servers (though you’ve claimed that you do- I find this highly unlikely). The majority of people have no issue with 15-20% being expected of them, I was actually surprised by so many people being so bitter about it, it never occurred to me that so many people never make mistakes at their jobs and expect the same perfection from others. I have personally never had an occasion where I felt, as a patron, that my server had done such a poor job that she did not deserve a tip, or deserved a sub standard one, but perhaps it’s all a matter of perspective. I don’t think it’s the end of the world if I have to wait momentarily to have my water refilled or send back my appetizer because the cook accidentally put bacon on it when I asked for it without. That’s just me. I don’t see the point in trying to justify tipping a server less than expected, because I just wouldn’t do it. I have compassion for people, and I wouldn’t wish anyone else to take a pay cut, so why would I do that to my server? I don’t expect anyone else to perform perfectly at a job, so why would I expect that of a server?
And all this talk of changing the industry? Nice, but while we’re waiting for fair server wages, let’s keep telling servers they should just suck it up and take what they can get. After all, they agreed to a crappy $2.50/hour wage, so they should just be grateful for your generosity, regardless of what you leave.
I plan to teach my child to tip 15-20% at a restaurant the same way I’ll teach him to write thank you notes for gifts he receives and to hold the door for people standing behind him at the mall. I just think it’s proper and polite, and when I have control over someone’s livelihood (to some extent), I want to make a positive impact on it. If I have a bad experience, I’ll have that rectified in some other way, but not by taking food out of someone’s mouth. I don’t think it’s my job to “teach” people that way.
And I don’t see the point in arguing otherwise. Like I said, leave what you want, but don’t try to justify it, and certainly don’t ask why people will think you’re cheap.
Good for you. Just so you know, I do have compassion, I do tip and generously, I do thank you notes, I hold doors, and I will teach my child to do the same. Again, you, and others on here assume because I question something I must be a horrible, impolite, uncompassionate, demanding, perfection-seeking demon. Well, you and all the others are wrong. There is absolutely nothing wrong with raising a question. There is something immensely wrong with trying to subvert question asking.
If you don’t like the pay, find another job. I think it ridiculous to EXPECT a tip for doing your job. I have never worked in the food service industry because I didn’t like the pay- or lack thereof. I do however work as a nurse where I touch blood and guts and body fluid everyday. I get puked on, bled on and have to clean it all up with a smile. I don’t get tipped because I was extra nice and made a bed up for your overnight guest, walked to the kitchen in the middle of the night for tomato soup or held your crying baby so you could get a couple hours of sleep. I have to deal with demanding patients- and often demanding families all night long and then still take care of my 4 other patients and thier families, reguardless of what “problems” I have on the shift. The lab can’t run a blood sample and I have to redraw your blood, the doctor has not returned a page and I still have not been able to get you the pain medication you asked for, the kitchen did not get your menu and brought you the wrong tray or I am delayed because I was assisting someone else. All my problem to fix, when none was my fault. I do however get talked to and/or written up if you complain that I was rude or was late on a request. I understand that I make a pretty good wage- but I work every weekend night because I don’t have childcare during the week (husband is a third year medical student… and not at home during the week). In other words- every job has good and bad, pick what you want and don’t complain about the bad! When (and it definately not often) we go to dinner as a family, I tip 15% if the service is average (drinks refilled timely, don’t have to ask multiple times for things, pay attention to my kids when they address you). I have tipped more, but it is for above and beyond service, and I don’t mind. It seems like because the tip is expected, the server does not feel they NEED to earn it. A far a tipping a hairdresser- charge me what you want me to pay, if I don’t think your service was worth the price, I won’t come back. I shouldn’t have to add extra to the bill to ensure that you will do a great job. My continued business as well a referrals should be enough for you to continue to do a great job with my hair. Yuck- this is kind of an onery post, but I feel like you should be paid based on the service you provide, not because your employer gets to include your expected tips into your salary. Maybe if people refused to work for such a low amount, the pay would increase. But it should not be my responsibility to supplement your income. I am already paying for my food and the time/space/dishes that I take up in the restaurant when I pay my bill and your employer pays you out of that. Again- if you don’t like the pros and cons that come with the job- do something else!
“I have never worked in the food service industry…”
Obviously.
Good points.
Okie dokie.
Your comments about not needing to supplement people’s pay-that employers need to do that- is ignorant at best. The fact is, if employers at salons, restaurants and the like paid their employees more an hour/per haircut, etc., then YOU would be paying more for the service! The employers aren’t going to be able to make up the difference created by their employees no longer receiving tips without RAISING prices on said services. If the industries are forced by the government to raise salaries to ‘minimum wages’ then so be it. But until then you’re not hurting the employer who won’t pay their employees properly. You’re hurting the employees.
That’s her point. Raise the rates for services and good if thats what it takes to keep people from being reliant on others opinions and whims for their pay.
That’s all fine and dandy, but, as things stand, that is not the situation. You’re right, it doesn’t make sense that the patron is responsible for making an arbitrary decision about a server’s salary, but that’s how the system is set up. Just because you disagree with the system does not change the rules of tipping etiquette. Regardless of anyone’s feeling on what tips should be, proper etiquette still dictates 15-20%. I have yet to see a source that claims proper etiquette to be 15-20%…but less if you get bad service. If you get bad service- talk to a manager. That’s the same thing you would do if you got any other bad service. You certainly wouldn’t insist the cashier at Target have her salary reduced because she gave you poor service- you would complain and the cashier would be reprimanded appropriately. It is certainly up to everyone to decide what they’d like to tip, but opinions on the matter still do not change the fact that a proper tip is 15-20% of a bill before discounts.
Liz: you are not tipped, but you also are not making $2.50/hour, so your situation is not comparable. I’m not saying you don’t do a lot of work, but if your pay was at the mercy of your clients, I would hope they would be willing to pay you appropriately and not complain about it.
Of course I understand how the system is set up. I don’t deny servers their tip because I disagree with it. Just because I don’t think its the best system, doesn’t mean I’m going to punish those who have nothing to do with it. However, without the ability to question the efficiency and practicality of the system, nothing will ever change. Just because someone questions the hows and whys of tipping in the food service industry doesn’t mean they don’t tip (as has been assumed by I think most everyone commenting to my questioning posts). The Target cashier example is not comparable for the same reason; the established system is such that people receive less tip for less or lowered quality service (and vice versa). That’s not the way the system works for a cashier at Target. However, if that’s they way society wishes it to be then they should question it….but they must be prepared to be called stupid, sucky, and ignorant as I have been called in this forum.
Since the food service industry in our state is allowed to pay significantly less than hourly minimum wage when tips are allowed, we always tip when we eat out. We typically will tip 20% of the bill unless it is a restaurant we frequent and/or the service was outstanding. If service is horrible, we typically will tip less than 10%. This way the waitstaff understands that we are not the type of jerks that just don’t tip, or just tip the minimum. If possible, I will let someone in management know that the service/food/restaurant was unacceptable.
I was just thinking about the math. Let’s say that a server has five tables in one hour. Let’s put an average of two diners per table at a food bill of $15 each, typical for a family restaurant like TGI Fridays, etc. This is for the entree and non-alcoholic drink, no desserts, no appetizers, and before taxes. The restaurant is paying the server $2.50 for that hour.
The total for all the diners is $150. %15 of that is $22.50 assuming that adequate service is provided to all tables and all tip appropriately.
Add that to what the restaurant’s wage is, and the server got $25 for that hour, well above minimum wage. Out of that, the server has to pay taxes and possibly share some of the tip, but we all have to pay taxes.
Yes, I understand that not all hours would be like that, etc, etc. Some hours would be even better because I rarely see people just get an entree and a soda each. But you see, when you become a server, you are willingly engaging in a gamble that more hours will be like that one than where you have one customer and a $2 tip. If you are a great server, the great tips should balance out the misers who you couldn’t please even if you spoon-fed them. It is the nature of the job.
Great point!
It’s actually not a great point for many, many reasons. Primarily that a server NEVER has 5 tables at a time for the entirety of his/her shift. At my current job, I actually only have 3 tables in my section at any given time. I also spend an enormous amount of time setting up (I actually spent over 4 hours on Wednesday with no tables because I was setting up/breaking down the dining room, during which time I was making $3/hour, which makes my average hourly salary quite a bit lower).
Right.. but arent you guaranteed min wage anyway by your employeer if you dont meet the states requirements for min wage?
If you don’t like the pay, find another job.
Amen! Tipping is optional, it should always be optional and never expected. There should be no expected amount or percentage when it comes to tipping. You should tip if you are provided with good service but it is your choice. If you are given poor service then you can reduce the amount of the tip or not at all. There are no “rules” to tipping, that is absurd. If you aren’t okay with $2.50 an hour and perhaps the possibility of a tip if you take care of your patrons, then get a different job with an acceptable hourly pay or salary.
Besides, you are all discussing semantics. If a person chooses to tip then they can make their own rules about it. Each person is different and can do whatever they want. The real discussion should be why people and their employers think it is part of their salary/wages.
In some respect, it is a matter of semantics. There are those who feel that a gratuity is a “bonus” and some who feel it is a “salary”. I, personally, feel that it depends on the situation. At a coffee shop where the barista gets paid a living wage, I feel it is a bonus. If it’s a shop that I frequent, I usually feel that giving the worker her “bonus” is well worth it, because I receive better service and I get to make a person who may be having a bad day feel better. In the case of a server, I have to disagree that the tip is a “bonus” rather than a salary. I think it’s humorous that people argue that this is not the case. If it were not the case, the government would require employers to pay tipped servers the state minimum wage. They do not, because a server’s salary includes both tips and hourly wage, the same way a car salesman’s salary includes commission and an additional wage. Just because the wage is at the discretion of the diner does not make it a bonus. To argue that people accepting a server position should be content with $2.50/hour and the chance of something additional is absolutely ludicrous. Do you really think ANY job should be pay $2.50/hour? I don’t.
If it would make everyone happy, we could change to an “easier” system like, say, France’s. In France, servers make a very decent hourly wage, plus a commission that is built into the price that is built into each menu item, plus a euro or two bonus at the discretion of the diner. No one there complains about how much servers make or that they have to tip (what an INCONVENIENCE, paying for a service!).
It’s not the patron’s fault that tips are viewed as part of the salary by those in the industry or the government. The fact is that tipping is discretionary. If it is creating such a huge problem for people then they should seek to be placed on the same minimum wage and market pay as other industries. However, be prepared for no tipping at all then.
I simply find it dangerous for servers trying to make a living that you would allow anyone room for justification for tipping 10% or below, and that is what you are doing (intentionally or not, the general public generally takes whatever they want from what one is saying, and that’s what people are going to hear). There are people in this forum looking for clarification on what is tipping etiquette and you are allowing room to excuse, let’s say, a 5% tip, because it is discretionary. Just because you can do what you want does not mean it is acceptable.
Yes, tip is discretionary, but that means that patrons have the power to give someone a tip that will allow them to earn an acceptable wage, or to deny them that. To deny someone an acceptable wage is inexcusable. Until the system is changed, it IS the responsibility of the patron to pay the salary of the server.
I would be more than happy to go to an hourly pay, it would make my budget much easier to manage. In countries that tip servers as a bonus (like France), servers fair EXTREMELY well. If the pay were not enough, I have options for salaried positions, but others are not so lucky, and those are the people who really need defended here.
Wow, I don’t know what to do with all this power I just found out I have. And to find out how dangerous I am…. I just don’t know what to do with myself.
Come on, now. Let’s not be so dramatic. I highly doubt my points of view are going to cause a mass change, increase or decrease, in the way people administer their tips. By the way, I never advocated for 10% or less or any other specific amount. I never advocated for any specific amount, period. My initial arguments were against expectation and have evolved to include putting the blame for inconsistent server pay on employers and the government, not the patrons. Lastly, my arguments most certainly do excuse a 5% or a 95% tip. Discretionary means it’s up to the person. If that system produces an unsustainable way to make a living there are two options: change jobs or change the system. Patrons should not have the pressure placed upon them to decide someone’s pay and then risk raising the ire of the server if that particular server feels like they deserved a 20% tip as opposed to say a 15% tip.
I would add that it’s more dangerous to try to silence other points of view or discourage dialogue. That’s not going to fix anything.
I agree with that comment as well!!! If you don’t like it get a different job. If the “acceptable” tipping percentage goes up as well as menu prices nobody is going to be able to afford to eat out anymore! I am sure there are things every person can think of that they don’t care for in their job, but that being said IT IS YOUR JOB and we knew what we were getting ourselves into. I don’t have a problem with tipping extra for good service and even the 15% for awful service, but for it to be expected by the server kind of irritates me.
That’s been my point all along…the expectation. But if you question it, people assume you’re a wretch of a person who never tips at all.
it’s not that easy to get another job, espcially with this economy.
and being in college, with the only work experience i can get being wait staff..
how would you like me to go about getting something else?!
any advice would be lovely!
Annonymous – I think the point is that you choose to be a server, with variable wages and you assume that your salary will be decent, based on both wages and tip. I understand that it is tough to find a job in this economy, but I’m sure that a fast food chain would hire you (based on your experience) in a minute. Then, you would get consistent pay, and your salary wouldn’t be up to the mercy of the customer. I assume that you haven’t made this move because fast food chains don’t pay as much as you want.
The economy isn’t her fault and her point is valid. It’s a system that people enter knowing that everybody has different ideas on tipping. So, be prepared for a range of tips (or unfortunately none at all).
fyi, birthday party hosts, like at roller skating rinks do NOT have gratuity included in your party package that you pay for.
i work my butt off, and half the time never get a tip.
i do still get my hourly minimum wage, but if im working like crazy to help your kid have the best birthday party ever, it’d be nice to get a tip, even $5 is fine.
I like that attitude. If you worked my kid’s party, I’d take good care of you for that great outlook.
Yes IF you worked your butt off I would tip you. However, the person we had for my daughter’s birthday was there all of 5 min when she brought out the character. The rest of the time we were picking up our own food, getting our own drink/pitchers. The hostess did nothing! What ticked me off is that there was an extra charge on my bill for her sub par service.
As for you personally I am glad you work hard for your customers. It is people like you that make me return to certain restaurants.
I have friends who logic like this, as well. What you’re forgetting is that a server is usually working for about 3 hours/night not taking tables. This means that for 3 hours, the server is only making $2-3/hour.
Let’s assume a 6 hour shift. A usual night might go like this: 1 hour of set up ($3), 1 hour with only 1 table- this might be the 4:30pm-5:30pm pre-dinner time ($9- $3/hr+$6 tip), 2 hours of the scenario you set up- usually 5:30-7:30 hours ($25), 1 hour of so-so business- let’s assume the server makes just shy of your scenario ($23) and 1 hour of clean up ($3). So, for 5 hours, the server makes $63…which comes out to $10.50/hour, and this is before tipping bartenders, hosts or bussers. Let’s assume a $10 tip out (which is low)…that makes $53/6 hours, or $8.83/hour- or just above minimum wage.
Now, business is going to vary, but just because a server can realistically make $25 during 1 or 2 hours on a busy friday night does not mean a server makes $25/hour or anything close to that.
sorry, I was intending to reply to justthisgirl’s “math” scenario, which was quite off base. I know for a fact that TGIFriday’s servers don’t make an easy $25/hour in most areas.
I’m sorry, the total should be $53/hour after tip out in my scenario- or $10.50/hour. That seems about right for a decent night where the server gets to leave relatively early.
A server who has to close the restaurant would have several more hours of “so so” business, sometimes only making a couple of dollar tips/hour (how many people are eating out from 10pm-11pm?), significantly lowering his/her hourly average.
Here is another thing to think about: Do you tip when you order from a drive thru (ie McDonalds)? They also prepare your food, bag it up, and throw in the condiments as well.
I tip based on the service i am given. If you are rude then i tip less than the 15%. A few times I have not tipped at at. But if you are great, I will tip over the 15%.
Hair cuts and nail salons are the hardest. They get paid more than $2.15 an hour, so this im not sure what I should be tipping. but usually around 10%.
For haircuts I usually tip 20%, but lately I’ve been going to an in home person and so I pay her her price and then tip her kids for graciously watching mine.
Baggage handlers, only had to do this once and it was for an overseas move. Sorry but when I have 15 bags, a dog, and 2 carseat, I WILL NOT pay $5+ per bag. However, I will pay a decent amount, but to take my bags all of 10ft there is no way I’d pay that.
Fast food or coffee places, sorry no tip. You make more than min wage and especially here, way more than min wage.
We are military so in the grocery store baggers work for tips only. Depending on the amount of bags I will tip between $2 and $5. Usually I just go to self checkout though.
In the states I tip our servers roughly 20%. Same goes for delivery drivers. Here, overseas servers make more than my husband does because it is the law in this country. Their tip is automatically calculated into the bill as well, but for exceptional service I will tip a few euros extra. For on base restaurants it is usually 20%, but i have tipped .15 once. We were seated in the bar area and the server only had 2 tables. We waited 30 min for food (not a busy night), our drinks were empty, and then had to wait another 30 min for our check. Where was our server? Sitting at the bar talking to his friends. We complained to the manager and haven’t seen him since, but when you are military overseas, you have a very limited supply of servers and most are teenagers with no experience. Recently at the same establishment I have waited over 30 min to be acknowledged that I was sitting in a server’s section. This happened on two separate occasions a with both instances the servers themselves walked past me more times than I could count. We have since stopped going here because with all these issues it seems the management has failed to train their teenaged staff very well.
Yes I have worked as a server. Never did I have to pay the bus boys as we bussed our own tables and being in a dry county there was no bar. At my restaurant we didn’t have to pool tips, but others did in our area. I worked my butt off for my tips. Anytime I was doing something other than waiting tables ie setup, phones, register, working in the back, I was paid min wage so I guess I was lucky in that sense. My favorite customers were the gi’s fresh out of the field. Their bill would be well over $100 and the NCO paying for it would put a $20 tip on the cc plus each soldier would tip $5-$10. Those were the best nights to work.
I will admit I’ve never been a server and never wanted too/needed too so maybe that’s why I’m not a good tipper but I do believe if I get crap service I don’t give any tip..If I good service I give what I think is appropriate..I don’t go by a ‘scale’ of what someone tells me to do..my money my way.
Like my husband says, if they don’t like the money they make then they will get another job..
i always tip at a resturant if i am picking up a to go order and the cashier or whoever has been very helpful and good attitude then ill slip her a tip as well. I tend to tip people just for generosity. I feel horrible if i am low on money and can not tip. The way i see it God has blessed us, and it never hurts to give a dollar or 2 here and there or at most a 5.. You never know what the person’s situation is and they just may greatly appreciate it!
This is a very touchy subject. When my husband and I go out to eat, from the time we sit down and depending on the speed of the food’s arrival, we are only there anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour. With that said, if our meal is $80, which was what it was last weekend for our anniversary, we are expected to pay an extra $16 for a half hour to an hour’s worth of work waiting on two people? That’s almost double what I make for an hour of work..continuous work..not stopping by someone’s table a few times. We still tip anyway regardless of my views, but the restaurant industry an the whole tipping business aggravates me. Going out to eat anymore feels like a special treat because prices and expectations are so high.